‘A Taste of Leeds’

Vegan and Veggie Quarterly Interview. January, 2006.

by Kevin Watkinson

Kevin Watkinson, editor of ‘A Taste of Leeds’ magazine interviews Claudette Vaughan on her new e-zine.

KW: For our readers would you like to say a little bit about what The Abolitionist is...

CV: It’s an online animal rights E-zine. I started the Abolitionist-Online – A Voice for Animal Rights, because I was sick to death of dealing with shitty meagre-souled editors watering down the abolitionist position. Either that or the difference between rights and animal welfarism wasn’t recognised – and frankly, I was itching to move on.

So I was thinking in this vein then in a casual conversation with Gary Francione he suggested why not do your own thing and that was really the catalyst to get the whole thing up and running.

After two issues of the Abolitionist-Online being published and I’m busy correlating the third issue now (up in early March, 2006) that there is no shortage of rights/liberationist material being presented to us and many people email to say hey, they like what we’re doing.

Due to the customary generosity of grassroots AR activists in making time to be interviewed, it’s incredibly worthwhile.

There is no shortage of writers either. Activists who previously moved away from the movement because they became disillusioned with it are now coming back and are writing for us. Important ideas are being discussed including the role, if any, of violence within the movement and we’re making an effort to critically examine all kinds of new things, like vegan art and humour. Also, our goal is to give the isolated vegan activist a voice too. Isn’t that what grassroots activism is all about?

The cost of getting each issue up would feed two small Nepalese families a year, so we’re making it our business to encourage the financially challenged vegan/ animal rights person in war torn Latin America or Russia or Poland etc to tell us their story so we can give them some freedom so to write about their experiences in animal rights/liberation/rescue work.

KW: I’ve been following the last couple of issues since I found a link at veganforum.com, and have been impressed by the way that articles regarding the environment and human rights are also tied into animal rights. Do you see the three as intrinsically linked?

CV: Yes and No. I set up the Abolitionist because I thought liberationist ideas were becoming sidelined in people’s minds. A kind of resignation had set in with grassroots activists as there was so little progress so perhaps some groups thought they should sell-out and work with the farmers on lobbying for a homegrown carcass trade etc. That kind of thing.

As a sideline, collectively the Australian AR movement has caused well over 11 million dollars worth of reform damage to the live exports industry – but once again, all the Industry did was clean up their act and they’re back in business, bigger and bolder than ever.

It’s important to make it perfectly clear that we call for the total abolition of the live export trade. Aside from any thing else, unequivocal opposition to the live export trade leaves no margin for misinterpretation.

As for aligning ourselves with human rights issues, well that’s fine if there’s something to say that can tie us in together. Ken Setter, who was the first person in NSW to vote in surveillance equipment first ever used in raids in NSW, was saying the other day that “America’s biggest export is violence”. We’re getting an article soon from him based around that one sentence because it’s important and because violence effects both non-humans and humans alike. (see Ken Setter’s ‘Why Do People Hate America?’ book review)

As for intrinsically linking environmental issues and liberationist views, I want to avoid doing this in a false and generalised way. Better to set out our differences if that be the case. It just depends on who’s doing the writing.

If it’s Captain Paul Watson or Derrick Jensen then it’s important. They are our comrades.
If it’s the usual lazy environmentally university desk trained despot who’s making decisions based upon the “numbers”, as they do in the kangaroo industry, then let’s point out the error of his ways to him/her.

KW: There are issues around the intervention of politicians in our lives, and one of the recent articles talks about anarchist ideas. Politicians and big business have mustered power to themselves to make it difficult for people to change the system. Do you think that people interested in animal rights need to get to grips with the State?

CV: I think the State, and its agency the police, are making it harder for people to get to grips with the need for animal rights. Despite some of the unintentional mistakes that has occurred in the animal rights movement so far in its 30 year modern-day existence, despite that, there’s a legitimate justice movement happening and it’s not going away.

Now the State and its agency the police are going to have to deal with that because our movement, just like the movement to abolish slavery, is born out of a spiritual vision and out of an anger towards what’s being done to the non-human animal kingdom today on the planet by humans.

Politics per se, doesn’t have the clout or capability to significantly destroy this vision that each one of us fosters within ourselves.
The animal liberationist is not an endangered species. We will always have people walking among us who are prepared to liberate animals in trouble.

The police might try and squash them or silence them but they can’t kill them off. The movement itself is too important for that and too many people are now too aware (and too politically cynical) and understand that animal rights is neither a terrorist or auxiliary movement to bed it with any other movements or organisations that are ‘out there’.

We stand alone in this uniqueness.

When people say to me that can’t support direct action I ask them what other group of people do you know of that is willing to risk everything, that works for neither fame nor money to rescue non-human animals? There’s no answer to that. To rescue animals, when the stakes are so high, is an egoless thing to do.

KW: Veganism is a radical approach that most people interested in 'alternative lifestyles', are respectful of but don't seem particularly interested in practising. What do you think some of the reasons might be behind this?

CV: It’s a good question. I don’t know the answer for certain. At a Earth/Womens’ Festival held in the Blue Mountains and inspite of the fact that the place was packed with interesting, intellectually stimulating activists, I noticed that 99% of their shoes lined up outside were made of leather.

Some great minds were there, but not great enough to fore-go their leather shoes apparently! Although the food served at the function was vegan, I think Germaine Greer even made a joke that she would prefer to eat at MacDonalds. How disappointing! That’s all we need. A ‘celebrity’ making jokes about vegan food.

Once more feminists en mass gets behind the animal rights movement we’ll see another wave of changes occurring. Feminists are the original stoics. They don’t like being told by patriarchy what to do and they don’t mind telling them they don’t like it either.

I’m very excited about the future of the animal rights movement. Our job is to eradicate speciesism. Just as we don’t discriminate on the basis of pigmentation or genitalia, so too is the future ripe to abolish speciesism.

In the early days of the feminist movement, feminists rallied to the call to eradicate sexism and people laughed at them and told them it couldn’t be done. All forgotten now, but in their droves feminists left husband and home to plant the seed of liberation for women further on down the track. The task was enormous and dangerous (esp for black political activists) and many sacrifices were made. The same is asked of feminists again who join the animal rights movement because once you see it, there’s no turning back. Isn’t that true for all of us?
I predict in the future we’ll see more vegans coming through working on both sides of the law.
Patriarchy has never yielded to reason for the greater good. It has to be fought for and taken.

KW: I recently heard someone say that it was our duty to eat cows otherwise there would be a surplus from the dairy industry. Have you come across any new interesting arguments against veganism lately?

CV: Sure. People are always very fond of saying why they aren’t vegan. The thing is we don’t have to defend ourselves for being vegan. We already have the ethical and environmental arguments on our side.

You know, it’s extremely difficult to understand the scale and purpose of animal slaughter. It is extremely difficult to ascertain why there is so much pain, bloodshed, wars and suffering in the world. The nonhuman animal kingdom are our younger brethren and the animal rights movement is committed to leading the animal kingdom towards its liberation. This evolutionary process can’t occur on a large scale if humans remain unchanged. As far as I am concerned, veganism is a large part of initiating that evolutionary process.

If others can’t see that, or don’t want to come on this journey – that’s their look out. Whether it’s veganism or on a demo or a march or rescue or whatever, I, like you Kevin, are here for one reason only and that’s for the animals. We don’t have to apologise for that.

KW: Why is veganism so important to you?

CV: It is important because we are one more generation that is choosing food that is killing us. I prefer to argue veganism for animal rights reasons but there is a convincing argument that the only effective, sustainable long-term method for preserving and increasing our health is through eating a plant-based diet. Veganism successfully addresses diseases born out of the classic modern western diet and associative ailments like heart disease, obesity and cancer.

Take milk for example. Cow’s milk is a menace to the human body. Vegan education is all about changing habits ---and unfortunately, old habits die hard. Not only do humans accept the general habit of milk drinking as natural, but they compound ignorance by willingly drinking copious quantities of “foreign” milk. I think Dr Michael Klapper, M.D. said it best when he said, “The human body has no more need for cow’s milk than it does for dogs milk, horse’s milk or giraffe’s milk.”

In fact not the next issue of the Abolitionist (March) but June’s issue will be exclusively delving into the politics of food production and distribution and we will be making a case for a vegan world. Watch out for that!

See: www.Abolitionist-Online.com